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Duel2 :: View topic - 11-8-11-6-9-19-6
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KidArcane
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:00 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Wow. Another "sort of" and "almost". I've got nothin' for this one except MAYBE 17-8-11-11-9-21-7 Basher. Good for maybe two or three wins, tops??

I'm perplexed and troubled. I'm probably going to throw this into the Dark Arena. But just in case anyone has a better option... I'm open.

Whatta ya got? Rolling Eyes

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Assurnasirbanipal
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:40 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

This guy is bad. Designs I see
17-8-11-11-9-21-7 (your design). Looks about as good as anything.
12-14-11-6-15-19-7 TP. Bad scum. Probably the easiest design to get a win with.
16-8-11-10-9-20-10 (9 will burner, ha ha ha)
17-8-11-7-15-19-7 L (My attempt to win in the Dark Arena)
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The Consortium
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Joined: Nov 23, 2002
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Location: on the golf course, in the garden, reading, traveling, and now Consulting

PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 12:56 am Reply with quoteBack to top

KidArcane wrote:
Wow. Another "sort of" and "almost". I've got nothin' for this one except MAYBE 17-8-11-11-9-21-7 Basher. Good for maybe two or three wins, tops??

I'm perplexed and troubled. I'm probably going to throw this into the Dark Arena. But just in case anyone has a better option... I'm open.

Whatta ya got? Rolling Eyes


We think the best winning chances are:
11-8-11-11-15-21-7 SL/ST
13-14-11-6-15-19-6 TP

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Ye Old Consortium Scribe & Crapmaster 2013, Crapgiver 2014
982 ADM graduates (with 40+ manager IDs) including 101K+ fights and 65K+ wins plus 4 teams with 1000+ wins (Animal Farm DM11 @1479*; Bulldogs DM11 @ 1420; Lenpros DM30 @ 1396; Fandils @ 1305
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KidArcane
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:45 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Assurnasirbanipal wrote:
This guy is bad.


Interesting. Both Assurnasirbanipal (the "Basher Guy") and the Consortium ("I can win with anything" guy) are in favor of raising the WL to add "oomph" to the design. [ 17-8-11-7-15-19-7 L (Assurnasirbanipal's attempt to win in the Dark Arena) AND Consortium's 13-14-11-6-15-19-6 TP. ]

Consortium LOVES the T.P., I gotta say. Wink

But I'm a bit confused. Yes, this is not an optimal design. Speed is WAY too high and WT far too low to make the best use of this speed. Everything else is not too bad; the low WT/SP ratio is what kills this for me. However, I thought that high-strength / high-speed Bashers had an edge in the arena vs ST, SL, LU, and other BA's --- at least for the first few turns??

How does WL add to the design? Does it make the character more resistant to 'death-check' rolls when it's tagged? Or is the idea to try to burn some skills? The endurance won't change substantially.

After this my plan is to D.A. his punk self and get something new. In the meantime --- I have 'other projects' that will be seeking out the Dark Arena's facilities...

I ran this design (with various permutations) through the TerraBlood site. Isn't 'GREAT' damage okay for a basher? If he lucks out and rolls 'TREMENDOUS' damage he'd be a keeper no matter how low his WT, correct? Confused

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The Consortium
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:56 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Not so sure of your question. Of course WL is helpful to designs. Most stats can help a design.
WL
adds endurance
can give certain skills (e.g. at 15)
enhances the $ of further training stats
enhances the will check
adds a tiny bit of HP
etc, etc

read the design articles in the just posted DM93 newsletter and they will give further info on Assur and Consortium thinking

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KidArcane
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:50 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I read your articles regularly, Consortium. I read that newsletter regularly too. Wink Sometimes I learn something new.

I guess what I'm saying is that I'm surprised. I would have thought that you would have raised ST or DF in order to make the most of that ridiculously high SP, which is an attribute that is of very little use, IMO.

(I can't think of one style that absolutely NEEDS speed to be higher than 4 or 5. All can do very well with single-digit speed.)

So I was wondering what the thought process was, that's all. I was wondering what style you would have picked to handle that speed, and whether you guys would have chosen ST or DF to raise. Slasher or Basher would have been my two choices, but... WT is just too low for either to be long-term. Confused

Yes, I realize that WL is important for a variety of things; I personally believe that it is THE most important stat of all, with WT coming in second and CN/SZ tying for third place. But that's just me.

HOWEVER, given that my 17 WL fighter took four turns to raise a stat recently, I don't see this as a viable 'Burner' either, given the 15 WL, so I just focused on ST and threw my hands up in vulgar and despairing gesticulations.

Who knows? Maybe this will get TREMENDOUS damage and a lucky bonus and make a kill in the Dark Arena. Smile

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The Consortium
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:39 am Reply with quoteBack to top

KidArcane wrote:
I read your articles regularly, Consortium. I read that newsletter regularly too. Wink Sometimes I learn something new.

I guess what I'm saying is that I'm surprised. I would have thought that you would have raised ST or DF in order to make the most of that ridiculously high SP, which is an attribute that is of very little use, IMO.

(I can't think of one style that absolutely NEEDS speed to be higher than 4 or 5. All can do very well with single-digit speed.)

So I was wondering what the thought process was, that's all. I was wondering what style you would have picked to handle that speed, and whether you guys would have chosen ST or DF to raise. Slasher or Basher would have been my two choices, but... WT is just too low for either to be long-term. Confused

Yes, I realize that WL is important for a variety of things; I personally believe that it is THE most important stat of all, with WT coming in second and CN/SZ tying for third place. But that's just me.

HOWEVER, given that my 17 WL fighter took four turns to raise a stat recently, I don't see this as a viable 'Burner' either, given the 15 WL, so I just focused on ST and threw my hands up in vulgar and despairing gesticulations.

Who knows? Maybe this will get TREMENDOUS damage and a lucky bonus and make a kill in the Dark Arena. Smile


Most styles can use SP. Perhaps other stats provide more in most cases, but high speed offensives can have surprising value. TPs can "make use of" the SP, but prefer their lunches composed of ST, CN, WL

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The Consortium
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:41 am Reply with quoteBack to top

KidArcane wrote:
So I was wondering what the thought process was, that's all.


This last DM93 newsletter lists The Consortium "design principles" in a spot.

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Ye Old Consortium Scribe & Crapmaster 2013, Crapgiver 2014
982 ADM graduates (with 40+ manager IDs) including 101K+ fights and 65K+ wins plus 4 teams with 1000+ wins (Animal Farm DM11 @1479*; Bulldogs DM11 @ 1420; Lenpros DM30 @ 1396; Fandils @ 1305
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KidArcane
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:53 am Reply with quoteBack to top

The Consortium wrote:
KidArcane wrote:
So I was wondering what the thought process was, that's all.


This last DM93 newsletter lists The Consortium "design principles" in a spot.


One last question for the Consortium, which is very loosely linked to this thread, but...

When would you say: "Enough is enough!"? You don't mention this in your articles (I've never read it in any article of yours that I can remember) and you have stated: "All rollups have potential." I don't know where I read that quote, but I know I have... somewhere.

When I see this [ 11-8-11-6-9-19-6 ] I'm thinkin' that, sure, I can get a few wins MAYBE, but long-term this will end up costing far more losses than I am willing to allow. However, I have never known you to send any warrior to the D.A. Perhaps I've been forgetful. Wink

Haven't you ever seen a set of numbers that just screamed: "DARK ARENA"?? Surprised (And anyone else who has an opinion on that, let me know. May need to start another thread...)

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