DUEL 2 NEWSLETTER

Date   : 05/22/2009    Duedate: 06/04/2009

TRICORUS ARENA

DM-51    TURN-512

This Weeks Top Honors

THE DUELMASTER IS

PHAEDRA
AMAZON ELITE (536)
(51-5380) [15-10-1,106]

Chartered Recognition Leader   Unchartered Recognition Leader

PHAEDRA                        POSITION IS EMPTY
AMAZON ELITE (536)             
(51-5380) [15-10-1,106]        

Popularity Leader              This Weeks Favorite

HASARCH                        PHAEDRA
DARK HORSEMEN (433)            AMAZON ELITE (536)
(51-5444) [13-10-1,97]         (51-5380) [15-10-1,106]

THE CURRENT TOP TEAM

AMAZON ELITE (536)

          TEAMS ON THE MOVE            TOP CAREER HONORS
Team Name                  Point Gain  Chartered Team
1. AMAZON ELITE (536)          25
2. DARK HORSEMEN (433)         16      AMAZON ELITE (536)
3. SEA DOGS (569)              -4      Unchartered Team

                                       THE IRON HORDE (208)

The Top Teams

Career Win-Loss Record           W   L  K    %  Win-Loss Record Last 3 Turns    W  L K
 1/ 1 AMAZON ELITE (536)       183 153 13 54.5   1/ 2 AMAZON ELITE (536)        9  2 1
 2/ 2 SEA DOGS (569)            67  59  5 53.2   2/ 1 DARK HORSEMEN (433)       7  8 0
 3/ 3 DARK HORSEMEN (433)      702 788 23 47.1   3/ 3 SEA DOGS (569)            4  9 1

    '*'   Unchartered team                       '-'  Team did not fight this turn
   (###)  Avoid teams by their Team Id          ##/## This turn's/Last turn's rank

                                    TEAM SPOTLIGHT

      * }%|[-----+O+-----]|%{ * }%|[-----+O+-----]|%{ * }%|[-----+O+-----]|%{ *

                         ---===DELARQUAN REGIONAL NEWS===---

                                     Duelmasters
                                     -----------
 DM   1 MORDANT (turn 623): POOP DECK GUY of SEA DOGS (One Armed Bandit, mgr.)
 DM   2 NIANIA (turn 505): GALLORDIN of THE GOLDEN FISH (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM   3 OSKSI (turn 629): KOVARAMANN VOTH of GAMES LIBRARY (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM   5 KALTOS (turn 624): FELISSA HURM of THE MIDDLE WAY 5 (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM   6 TRANSEL (turn 624): HATTIE of PSYCHO SQUAD (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM   7 BONSUR (turn 627): HIERONYMUS ZIGG of SENTINELS (Nomad, mgr.)
 DM  10 KOLACT (turn 617): DEIMOS of THE MOONDOGS (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  18 TALCAMA (turn 613): DOT DOT DOT of CENTER FOR OLDS (Suave, mgr.)
 DM  21 SUNSET (turn 612): LEAD INSTRUCTOR of LIGHT BRIGADE (Woody, mgr.)
 DM  36 JHANS (turn 584): BAM BAM THE IMP of HOUSE OF RATS (?, mgr.)
 DM  38 CLIFFHOME (turn 576): TORCHILIGHT KID of U.A.K. (Otis the Drunk, mgr.)
 DM  39 XOCHITHLAN (turn 259): D'URVILLE of KIWI CONNECTION (The Mun, mgr.)
 DM  42 RODEKI (turn 560): CHATTY CABALIST of DUNGEON CELL (One Armed Bandit, mgr.)
 DM  51 TRICORUS (turn 511): CARGO of SEA DOGS (One Armed Bandit, mgr.)
 DM  54 TROCAR (turn 246): KORASIM of TRADERS OF TROCAR (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  59 ILLIS (turn 234): KIRRALA of ISLANDERS (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  62 VALAMANTIS (turn 461): ANGRY DECKHAND of DEATH MOB (Jakari, mgr.)
 DM  72 DRAGONHEAD (turn 210): UM-PAH of ONE MAN BAND (Allegro, mgr.)
ADM 104 DARKHOLM (turn 505): SUPER BUM of FLAT BROKE (The Muffin Man, mgr.)

                                      Top Teams
                                      ---------
 DM   1 MORDANT (turn 623): SEA DOGS (One Armed Bandit, mgr.)
 DM   2 NIANIA (turn 505): PEANUT BUTTER FUDGE (Gavin, Rule, mgr.)
 DM   3 OSKSI (turn 629): GAMES LIBRARY (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM   5 KALTOS (turn 624): THE MIDDLE WAY 5 (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM   6 TRANSEL (turn 624): PSYCHO SQUAD (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM   7 BONSUR (turn 627): SENTINELS (Nomad, mgr.)
 DM  10 KOLACT (turn 617): THE MOONDOGS (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  18 TALCAMA (turn 613): SEA DOGS (One Armed Bandit, mgr.)
 DM  21 SUNSET (turn 612): MONADIC TRIBE (Nomad, mgr.)
 DM  36 JHANS (turn 584): GIRLS GIRLS GIRLS (Non?, mgr.)
 DM  38 CLIFFHOME (turn 576): U.A.K. (Otis the Drunk, mgr.)
 DM  39 XOCHITHLAN (turn 259): KIWI CONNECTION (The Mun, mgr.)
 DM  42 RODEKI (turn 560): COLOR ME SUAVE (Suave, mgr.)
 DM  51 TRICORUS (turn 511): DARK HORSEMEN (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  54 TROCAR (turn 246): TRADERS OF TROCAR (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  59 ILLIS (turn 234): ISLANDERS (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  62 VALAMANTIS (turn 461): DEATH MOB (Jakari, mgr.)
 DM  72 DRAGONHEAD (turn 210): ONE MAN BAND (Allegro, mgr.)
ADM 104 DARKHOLM (turn 505) 0729205R et al (The Muffin Man, mgr.)

                                   Recent Graduates
                                  -----------------
 DM   1 MORDANT (turn 623): POOP DECK GUY of SEA DOGS (One Armed Bandit, mgr.)
                            WAYWARD SON of MANNEQUIN'S BEST (Mannequin, mgr.)
 DM   6 TRANSEL (turn 624): HATTIE of PSYCHO SQUAD (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  10 KOLACT (turn 616): JOLEEN KRUZ of THE MOONDOGS (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  18 TALCAMA (turn 612): BLUE MOON of RUN AND HYDE (Jekyll, mgr.)
                            HEXALUS of VINCERE AUT MORI (Toker, mgr.)
 DM  21 SUNSET (turn 612): LAGERKVIST of LITERATE LOONS (?, mgr.)
 DM  38 CLIFFHOME (turn 575): RUNNA DAMILL of U.A.K. (Otis the Drunk, mgr.)
 DM  59 ILLIS (turn 234): KIRRALA of ISLANDERS (Jorja, mgr.)
 DM  62 VALAMANTIS (turn 461): ANGRY DECKHAND of DEATH MOB (Jakari, mgr.)
                   (turn 460): EVANDER GILL of MIDDLE WAY 10 (Jorja, mgr.)

                                      SPY REPORT

     Oh, hi.  Its just little 'ol Debby Tonte.  Thought I'd check out TRICORUS to see 
what's new.  Like, DARK HORSEMEN had to be so embarrassed when they got kicked off #1 
spot by AMAZON ELITE!  Way to go AMAZON ELITE!  MVP award for OLYMPIA?  AMAZON 
ELITE's proud of her after beating DRUNKEN SAILOR and getting 7 points.  Talk about 
yer big time losers!  DRUNKEN SAILOR got smashed by OLYMPIA, and lost 5 points!  Oh, 
wow, like the Duelmaster must be the most popular guy in all TRICORUS.  He got the 
most challenges.  (But what about proposals?) PHAEDRA thinks hers 15-10-1 and studly 
character is good enough to face up to the Duelmaster.  Any bets?  Was that a tear I 
saw in PHAEDRA's eye, as she took over Duelmastership?  And wasn't CARGO fit to be 
tied!  Is the Duelmaster really being a real snob to his teammates?  Don't ask me!   
     So just why would someone becomes a warrior anyway?  It can't be for these 
really neat Spyreports can it?  The warriors of DARK HORSEMEN must be getting lonely. 
They were the most avoided team.  Do you guys know something that I don't?  Is there 
some deep dark secret why AMAZON ELITE's been avoiding DARK HORSEMEN so much?  Or is 
it just that they're too scared?   
     Man, all these warriors dying and killing each other!  Don't you guys ever give 
it a break?  Pinch me, I must be dreaming!!!  PRESS GANG GUY returns from the Dark 
Arena, maybe a "little upset" at his SEA DOGS teammates...  Hey you guys, don't you 
think your families would like to hear from you?  Write!  (Or have someone write for 
you.)  
     I really didn't, you know, study when I was a kid.  Who would've guessed I'd be 
a famous Spyreporter?  I know how much you like reading this stuff, but I really 
should stop.  I had a fun time, see you later-- Debby Tonte  

DUELMASTER                     W   L  K POINTS      TEAM NAME                  
 PHAEDRA 5380                 15  10  1   106       AMAZON ELITE (536)

CHALLENGER CHAMPIONS           W   L  K POINTS      TEAM NAME                  
 HASARCH 5444                 13  10  1    97       DARK HORSEMEN (433)
 CARGO 5335                   13  12  0    92       SEA DOGS (569)

CHAMPIONS                      W   L  K POINTS      TEAM NAME                  
 PRESS GANG GUY 5466           8   3  2    75       SEA DOGS (569)
 OLYMPIA 5357                  9   6  2    73       AMAZON ELITE (536)

CHALLENGER ADEPTS              W   L  K POINTS      TEAM NAME                  
-GOB 5436                      7   8  1    62       SEA DOGS (569)

ADEPTS                         W   L  K POINTS      TEAM NAME                  
 DRUNKEN SAILOR 5453          10   9  0    47       SEA DOGS (569)
 BAROCHDAL 5456                8  11  1    36       DARK HORSEMEN (433)

CHALLENGER INITIATES           W   L  K POINTS      TEAM NAME                  
-RYOKO 5382                    3   3  0    32       AMAZON ELITE (536)
 TERESAI 5472                  3   3  0    28       DARK HORSEMEN (433)

INITIATES                      W   L  K POINTS      TEAM NAME                  
 MAHAGHAL 5475                 2   1  0    20       DARK HORSEMEN (433)
 WACHICHU 5476                 3   0  0    15       AMAZON ELITE (536)
 SHALAITHA 5473                1   5  1     9       DARK HORSEMEN (433)
 URSULAH 5471                  0   3  0     3       AMAZON ELITE (536)

'-' denotes a warrior who did not fight this turn.

THE DEAD                W  L K TEAM NAME            SLAIN BY              TURN Revenge?
VICTORIA 5474           0  1 0 AMAZON ELITE 536     SHALAITHA 5473        509  JUST REVENGED
PRIEST OF KARN          0  0 0 DARK ARENA           PRESS GANG GUY 5466   512  NONE
BARNACLE 5451          11  8 0 SEA DOGS 569         OLYMPIA 5357          510   
MAN OVERBOARD 5478      0  1 0 SEA DOGS 569         WATER GOLEM           512  NONE

                                     PERSONAL ADS

     Hal has been misbehaving, and many personals sent in good time have not arrived.
     They should show up next time.  Well, we hope they'll show up next time.  For
     now, our apologies. -- the Editor

     Hal, Dark Arena!

29 April 09
Greetings All -- This is Vincent Michaels, "the Rake", mgr. of the Stormbringers out
of DM 33 Niatoli Island, back after a relatively long layoff.  I come back to my
arena to find only two other teams there.  Terrible!  I'm calling on all you managers
out there who have inactive teams in Niatoli to put them back in the game.  Also,
anyone else who wants to come check out our little island are welcome.  Good food and
a lot of good gambling, and you will have a chance to smack around Gen. GirlPants and
his band of Ravaged Queens.  Great fun.  Come one, come all!

4 May 09
Players of Duel 2:

RSI wants to try, in a few arenas, a system that rewards role-play and general arena
involvement.  Our thoughts at this time are as follows, and feedback is earnestly
solicited:

1.  What to reward.
a.  Spotlights--they don't have to be involved and lengthy storylines, and in fact,
my own inclination is to say: anything game related and original (i,e,, not a
reprint), maybe set a minimum length.  I use TOGS here as my model--half a column as
formatted for the newsletter, and we don't judge the quality of the writing (so long
as the editor isn't grossed out), just the intent to make a positive contribution.
b.  A dm column where one is "due."  Again, no judgment on quality of writing, should
be dm-related, and I would say (this is just me) a minimum length of maybe five
lines.
c.  Personals.  More than just "you suck," or "good fight."  How much more doesn't
really concern me, and quality, other than "not offensive to the editor," should not
be an issue.  We don't want to encourage participation and then muzzle it.
d.  It has been suggested that a reward point or two be offered for running a full
team.  We could include this, but my own inclination would be to say that there would
be no points for this, but that those who don't make a clear effort on this
(accidents happen, so maybe something like "when the three-turn total of fights is
below twelve"?) aren't eligible for points on any turn until they get it back up to a
full team.

2.  How to reward it.
a.  We've been thinking nebulously about some kind of point system, obviously, as an
example, say 3 points for a spotlight, 2 for a column, 1 for personals, more points
here for what takes more effort, but some points for any effort.  This is in no way
final!  But some way to keep track of who is contributing and how much, and as non-
subjective as possible; this would be noted as each newsletter would be proofed.  A
way to clearly identify who's sending in what would help, but I can work it out by
referring to the warrior listings if I have to.
b.  But, assuming a point system, do the rewards, whatever they end up being, go to
the player who achieves a certain point total?  Is this calculated per turn, or as a
running total over as many turns as it takes to reach that point?  Or to the player
with the highest total on any given turn?  What about ties?
c.  What do the points get the player?  The current thought is X points gets a free
fight, probably replacing the "Popularity Leader's" free fight in the relevant arena.
That suggests only one player getting a role-play free fight on any given turn.  Is
this enough to encourage the newsletter participation we're hoping for?  Should we
convert "This Week's Favorite" to a role-play free fight also?  Or handle rewards in
some other way entirely?

3.  Where it happens.
The current thought is, try it in four arenas:  one in each region, and one slow
arena.  Who picks the arenas in question?  I'd be inclined to rule out those that are
doing fairly well already (Ardivent, Sunset, Lapur; Arkers, Morya, North Fork), but
is that wise?  Or even fair?  Darned if I know.  Places where it is NOT currently
intended to happen:  Transfer arenas.  Maybe rule out the no-tourney arenas as
current candidates, too?

If this seems to work well enough to be worth the effort, should we consider
extending it to more, eventually to all non-transfer, arenas?

This is not a "someday down the line we might" concept.  We want to do this, and
SOON.  Your feedback would be appreciated, for, against, changes, anything.  You can
email me directly at jputney zianet com (make sure it says DM in the subject line) or
send a diplo to scribe, any arena.

the Scribe

P.S.  Staff members not to be eligible for role-playing free fights.

5 May 09
The Battle Royal V is upon us!  Come join one of the original contests that has had
some of the games best managers involved in the past.  DM 18, Talcama, some consider
it to be the crown jewel of the Delarq cities is where this contest will take place.

The Battle Royal is intended to be a play as you want, play what you want Delarquan
style contest with very few rules.  While I'd love to say, "NO AVOIDING" is the only
rule (and that wouldn't be too far off), I must spell out situations that can and
have occurred and require additional clarification.

The advantages of this format:
1) Simple.
2) No penalty for DAs.
3) No restrictions on warriors entered into the contest (baggers, TC mods, etc all
   welcome)
4) No penalty for not fighting. 
5) It isn't a race where 21 wit and favorite learn determine the victor.
6) Losing a warrior (or even your whole team) doesn't eliminate you from contention.
7) It is possible to overcome almost any deficit.  And this has been proven, with
   managers making huge point swings in short periods of time!
8) It is a contest designed to show manager skill rather than warrior ability.

There are a few disadvantages:
1) There is no set end.  It is possible for this contest to go on indefinitely.  In
   practice, this format has worked very nicely in the past and I expect it will
   continue to work well. 
2) You cannot avoid (But that is part of the fun and the head to head nature of this
   contest requires this rule.)
3) It encourages bloodshed.
4) Baggers and experienced warriors have an advantage over new warriors.

Battle Royal Rules:

- Any team in Talcama is eligible to participate.  There are no restrictions on
warriors (baggers, TC prize modified, etc).  However, any warrior that fights for
your team is considered in the BR.

- Teams may not avoid any other team within the contest.  (Note that you may avoid
teams outside the contest but you do so at your own risk.)  Avoiding a team on the
turn they enter the Battle Royal is not considered against the rules (since you
couldn't know the team wasn't part of the BR).  The suggestion is not to avoid at
all.  Assur (the contest moderator) gets an avoid report every turn and will catch
people avoiding!

- Managers may only enter a single team in the contest.

- Any manager with more than one team in Talcama may not challenge any other contest
warrior with their non contest team(s).  The intention is that no advantage can be
gained by having multiple teams in the arena.

****Failure to comply with the above rules***
1st offense: Disqualification from the prize, but you may still participate.
2nd offense: Warning.
3rd offense: Removal from Battle Royal.

- If a manager decides to switch teams, his score will start back at 0.  This is to
prevent a manager from sweeping the contest with several teams of sandbaggers.  Can a
manager use this clause to go from a negative score to zero?  Yes.  I realize this is
sort of cheating, but I'd rather have a manager start over with a new team than drop
out of the contest.  Even so, they have to start at 0 and must gain 25 points.

- If your warrior loses a contest fight because of an input error and this error is
verified by RSI, you will have a point added to your score.  The head to head records
will remain the same and any points gained by another manager will remain on that
manager's record.

- As soon as you are announced in the newsletter, you are officially entered into the
Battle Royal.  Scoring begins on that turn!  You are expected to follow the rules
that turn and every turn following.  Your team may enter any time they wish during
the course of the Battle Royal.

- If you are exiting the Battle Royal, you are not removed until the turn after your
intention is published.  You are asked to follow the rules for that turn (either
through not avoiding or not running your warriors).

Scoring:
- Scoring begins the turn your team declares participation.
- Scoring continues through the turn your team withdraws.
- Score is calculated by: Wins+Kills-Lossses.
- Only fights with other B.R. participannts count towards your score, but they count
  whether they are challenges or random match-ups.
- First Manager to 25 points wins!
- In event of tie, B.R. continues until one team that has reached 25 points is ahead
  of all other participants.

Disputes:
- The attempt has been made to make these rules as complete and bulletproof as
possible, but Tripwire will resolve any disputes as fairly as he is capable.

Prizes:
For the Winner:

6 Months Free Play in Talcama for the winning team (doesn't include tourneys)!

One +1 Bonus Potion (up to max for warrior, to be used on a warrior in DM 18)!

One Limited Damage Bump Potion (one time use, up to max for stats, used on DM 18
warrior)!

One Minor Stat Switch Prize (up to 2 points can be moved from one stat to another
stat on a new rollup in DM 18, before adding 14 points.  This prize can be used up to
3 months from the contest end.  Both points must be used in the same place (can't
take one from a speed and one from deftness and add one to wit and will)).

One Favorites Knowledge Potion (to be used on a 5+ FE warrior in DM 18).

Rename One Dark Arena Creature in DM 18, which will be renamed for 6 Months or until
the Ladies decide to return it to the previous name.

All potions renaming prizes must be used within 2 turns of the end of the contest.

Endurance Award (available to all participants):

One +1 Bonus Potion (up to max for warrior, to be used on a warrior in DM 18).

To qualify for the Endurance Award you must participate in 90% of the total fights
possible over the course of the BR.  If you don't have time to make it into the BR by
the first turn, there will be a two turn window before the counter will start for new
teams.  The fights do not have to be BR point scoring fights, just 90% of the total
possible participation over the course of the contest!  So, if the contest runs 26
turns, there are 130 fights possible. Your team must have 117 fights during those 26
turns to be eligible.

All prizes/potions subject to RSI's interpretation of how they are used/implemented.
RSI said the faves knowledge must be used on an Inits warrior or higher and set at
5FE or more.

Tripwire

                                  LAST WEEK'S FIGHTS

PRESS GANG GUY butchered PRIEST OF KARN in a 1 minute Dark Arena fight.
MAN OVERBOARD was butchered by WATER GOLEM in a 2 minute brutal Dark Arena duel.
PHAEDRA overcame CARGO in a action packed 2 minute veteran's Challenge Title match.
HASARCH devastated CONVICTED ASSASSIN in a popular 1 minute one-sided contest.
OLYMPIA demolished DRUNKEN SAILOR in a 1 minute mismatched competition.
BAROCHDAL was vanquished by DANGEROUS CRIMINAL in a 1 minute mismatched fight.
TERESAI was beaten by DANGEROUS CRIMINAL in a 1 minute brawl.
SHALAITHA was overcome by WACHICHU in a action packed 3 minute fight.
URSULAH was vanquished by MAHAGHAL in a 1 minute uneven duel.

                                    BATTLE REPORT

             MOST POPULAR                        RECORD DURING THE LAST 10 TURNS     
|FIGHTING STYLE               FIGHTS        FIGHTING STYLE     W -   L -  K   PERCENT|
|BASHING ATTACK                   3         AIMED BLOW         1 -   0 -  0     100  |
|SLASHING ATTACK                  3         LUNGING ATTACK     5 -   2 -  1      71  |
|LUNGING ATTACK                   2         WALL OF STEEL      3 -   2 -  1      60  |
|TOTAL PARRY                      2         SLASHING ATTACK   20 -  15 -  2      57  |
|PARRY-RIPOSTE                    1         TOTAL PARRY        9 -   7 -  0      56  |
|STRIKING ATTACK                  1         STRIKING ATTACK   11 -   9 -  0      55  |
|WALL OF STEEL                    1         PARRY-RIPOSTE      5 -   5 -  0      50  |
|AIMED BLOW                       0         BASHING ATTACK    13 -  15 -  2      46  |
|PARRY-LUNGE                      0         PARRY-LUNGE        3 -   6 -  0      33  |
|PARRY-STRIKE                     0         PARRY-STRIKE       0 -   0 -  0       0  |

Turn 512 was great if you     Not so great if you used      The fighting styles of the
used the fighting styles:     the fighting styles:          top eleven warriors are:

LUNGING ATTACK     2 -  0     SLASHING ATTACK    1 -  2         3  SLASHING ATTACK
BASHING ATTACK     2 -  1     AIMED BLOW         0 -  0         2  BASHING ATTACK 
TOTAL PARRY        1 -  1     PARRY-LUNGE        0 -  0         2  LUNGING ATTACK 
                              PARRY-STRIKE       0 -  0         2  STRIKING ATTACK
                              PARRY-RIPOSTE      0 -  1         1  TOTAL PARRY    
                              STRIKING ATTACK    0 -  1         1  PARRY-RIPOSTE  
                              WALL OF STEEL      0 -  1     

                               TOP WARRIOR OF EACH STYLE

FIGHTING STYLE   WARRIOR                     W   L  K PNTS TEAM NAME                  
SLASHING ATTACK  PHAEDRA 5380               15  10  1  106 AMAZON ELITE (536)

FIGHTING STYLE   WARRIOR                     W   L  K PNTS TEAM NAME                  
BASHING ATTACK   HASARCH 5444               13  10  1   97 DARK HORSEMEN (433)
TOTAL PARRY      CARGO 5335                 13  12  0   92 SEA DOGS (569)
LUNGING ATTACK   OLYMPIA 5357                9   6  2   73 AMAZON ELITE (536)
Note: Warriors have a winning record and are an Adept or Above.

The overall popularity leader is HASARCH 5444.  The most popular warrior this turn 
was PHAEDRA 5380.  The ten other most popular fighters were SHALAITHA 5473, HASARCH 
5444, PRESS GANG GUY 5466, OLYMPIA 5357, MAHAGHAL 5475, CARGO 5335, TERESAI 5472, 
WACHICHU 5476, DRUNKEN SAILOR 5453, and BAROCHDAL 5456.

The least popular fighter this week was MAN OVERBOARD 5478.  The other ten least 
popular fighters were URSULAH 5471, BAROCHDAL 5456, DRUNKEN SAILOR 5453, WACHICHU 
5476, TERESAI 5472, CARGO 5335, MAHAGHAL 5475, OLYMPIA 5357, PRESS GANG GUY 5466, and 
HASARCH 5444.